ZenPriest said: "Those social values required a social environment which no longer exists. They relied on clearly defined and largely separated sex roles. They cannot exist in a climate where the collective financial success of a lot of individual men - who then used that success to benefit the women in their lives, and their children - is being cast as a way that women are victimized at the cultural level by being paid less."What about them? Destroying the social value system which supported, constrained, and rewarded men into the protector provider roles actually makes it easier for men to abandon families, not harder.
A Harpie said: What about all the men who abandon their wives and children-I think this has something to do with why women want equal pay for equal work, because many of them support families. I've seen more than a few traditional-type women (they stayed home while he worked and took care of the house and kids) who then got left by their husbands
I really don't think anyone in the world is truly against "e-kwuhl pay fer e-kwuhl werk", the issue all boils down to an argument over what is equal. The feminists are pushing for equality of outcomes regardless of effort, which men do not see as having anything to do with real equality.
When someone takes time out from advancing their career, for whatever reason, that career is not going to advance as far and as fast as someone who dedicates more than full time and effort on it. A few years ago, a popular buzz phrase was "giving 110%". As much as that is complete nonsense, it could be literally looked at as comparing those people who work 40 hours per week with those who work 44 hours. Whether you are making widgets or commissioned sales, the person who puts in more time and effort is going to produce more results for their employer and be of more value, and thus earn any higher compensation they receive.
Someone who excercises for half an hour 3 days per week, when they feel like it, and often takes a week or few off, is not going to be in the same physical condition as someone who trains 2 hours per day every day and the fact that they are not has nothing to do with "discrimination" and is just simply the way things work.
In a basketball game, points get put on the scoreboard for getting the ball into the basket, not for "trying", not for "intending to put it in", but for actually accomplishing something.
Women can scream for "wage parity" all they like, and it ain't never gonna happen until they start being under the same pressures to earn money that men are, start putting in those extra hours to get those extra widgets or sales made, and start really accomplishing something like getting the goddamned ball into the basket.
And, that is going to happen because all this blather about "wage-parity" has convinced people that the men who actually did go out and put in the extra effort required to get results, so they could turn around and use that money to provide a better life for their wives and children, are actually proof that women have been victimized throughout history so the jobs are now being handed to women regardless of whether they can do them or not, simply because they have the primary qualification which is a noticable absence of anything dangling between their legs.
Everything, and I do mean everything which used to motivate men to make that extra money and stand by their family has been destroyed. It used to be that a man who would abandon his family experienced a sort of social death and became a complete outcast and pariah. But women are the ones who initiate 80% of the divorces in the US - so it is the female side who is pulling men's families away from them and making it damn near impossible for men to stay involved.
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